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on 01-24-2014 05:27 PM
This document was generated from CDN thread
Created by: John Mathew on 07-08-2013 11:30:20 AM
Hi all,
Newbie question please!
I am thinking of proposing C40 for distance learning in a few schools here in India.
I like the dual stream feature and the recording feature but not sure if they can both work together. Can anyone enlighten me? I think in dual stream mode both Video output connectors get used up (HDMI1 out to TV showing far end camera with main audio and DVI-I2 out to a second Monitor TV or Interactive Whiteboard for example). Is there a clever way to tap into both these streams for recording and mixing them up somehow?
Also how do I get all the audio streams into one connector for recording? Will the Line Out audio connector available somehow mix all the audio channels - Far end Mic, Far End PC audio, Local Mic and Local PC audio into one composite audio for recording? Some setting for that?
Once I have recorded the VC session, how to playback on same setup without disturbing any connections? I am thinking that the recorder HDMI output connected to C40 HDMI2 in with the audio. But will C40 somehow "pass through" this HDMI2 in video/audio to HDMI1 out when the unit is not on a VC call? Any setting for that?
thanks a bunch!
regards
John
Subject: RE: Recording VC session using C40
Replied by: David Bruun-Lie on 08-08-2013 05:26:39 AM
Hi John,
if you are going to use the C40 with two monitor outputs then they will take all the outputs and no outputs will be available for local recording. In this case you will have two options: 1) Use a network recorder instead that is just like dialling a site, however all video and presentation is recorded. Cisco TCS is one such video recorder device. 2) Use an external mixer to allow the outputs to be split into both monitor inputs and a local recording device.
Using TC Console application found on this site you can mix all audio sources to any Line Out connector.
To play back a local recording via HDMI2 input you can just start presentation and select HDMI2 as presentation source. That works even when device is idle.
Cheers,
David
Subject: RE: Recording VC session using C40
Replied by: John Mathew on 08-08-2013 08:40:27 AM
Hi David,
Thanks for the reply. Made me think about a few more things.
I looked up Cisco TCS. Few questions
a) I believe C40 can conference in 3 additional sites in addition to the main calling site (total 4 sites). So if Cisco TCS dials up C40 for recording, does that mean I have one less additional site available now i.e. 2 instead of 3?
b) I notice that C40 can have video input/output (HDMI/DVI) upto 1080p60, while live encode/decode upto 1080p30 (1472 Kbps). For TCS the live encode/decode is stated as 720p H.264 only (not specified whether 720p30 or 720p60). So, what happens within TCS during recording if the video conference is being broadcast live at 1080p30 (assuming that the 1080p60 HD cameras are being used and 2nd stream content is also 1080p60 at the endpoints)? Is some kind of down-conversion going on to 720p30 or 720p60 ? If this is indeed the case, what is the impact?
c) When TCS dials into C40 for recording, is the C40 local video+audio also recorded along with all remote participants video+audio, and also 2nd stream content (e.g. PC slide or video+audio)?
d) After recording, can TCS playback be done through C40 itself? Does the playback mimic the exact layout on C40 while conference was happening? For example, during actual conference, if HDMI 1 out was showing all remote participants video+audio (e.g. current speaker on fullscreen with overlay, voice switched) and 2nd stream audio, and DVI 2 out was showing 2nd stream content (e.g. PC slide or video only), then TCS playback can replicate this?
Thanks much!
John
Subject: RE: Recording VC session using C40
Replied by: David Bruun-Lie on 09-08-2013 02:14:48 AM
Cheers,
David
Subject: RE: Recording VC session using C40
Replied by: John Mathew on 09-08-2013 05:07:56 AM
David Bruun-Lie[quote=]
Can you elaborate on these two conditions, assuming that local C40 does not have multi-site option
a) In case the remote caller (from any H.323 device) dials into local C40 as part of initiating a multi-site call or intitiating 1:1 call, then can TCS dial into remote site which initiated the call for recording?
b) On the other hand, if the local C40 dials into remote H.323 device to join a multi-site call initiated remotely or initiating 1:1 call, can TCS dial into remote site for recording?
c) I assume trying to do it this way causes extra bandwidth needs for connecting local TCS to remote site?
Created by: John Mathew on 07-08-2013 11:30:20 AM
Hi all,
Newbie question please!
I am thinking of proposing C40 for distance learning in a few schools here in India.
I like the dual stream feature and the recording feature but not sure if they can both work together. Can anyone enlighten me? I think in dual stream mode both Video output connectors get used up (HDMI1 out to TV showing far end camera with main audio and DVI-I2 out to a second Monitor TV or Interactive Whiteboard for example). Is there a clever way to tap into both these streams for recording and mixing them up somehow?
Also how do I get all the audio streams into one connector for recording? Will the Line Out audio connector available somehow mix all the audio channels - Far end Mic, Far End PC audio, Local Mic and Local PC audio into one composite audio for recording? Some setting for that?
Once I have recorded the VC session, how to playback on same setup without disturbing any connections? I am thinking that the recorder HDMI output connected to C40 HDMI2 in with the audio. But will C40 somehow "pass through" this HDMI2 in video/audio to HDMI1 out when the unit is not on a VC call? Any setting for that?
thanks a bunch!
regards
John
Subject: RE: Recording VC session using C40
Replied by: David Bruun-Lie on 08-08-2013 05:26:39 AM
Hi John,
if you are going to use the C40 with two monitor outputs then they will take all the outputs and no outputs will be available for local recording. In this case you will have two options: 1) Use a network recorder instead that is just like dialling a site, however all video and presentation is recorded. Cisco TCS is one such video recorder device. 2) Use an external mixer to allow the outputs to be split into both monitor inputs and a local recording device.
Using TC Console application found on this site you can mix all audio sources to any Line Out connector.
To play back a local recording via HDMI2 input you can just start presentation and select HDMI2 as presentation source. That works even when device is idle.
Cheers,
David
Subject: RE: Recording VC session using C40
Replied by: John Mathew on 08-08-2013 08:40:27 AM
David Bruun-Lie:Hi John,
if you are going to use the C40 with two monitor outputs then they will take all the outputs and no outputs will be available for local recording. In this case you will have two options: 1) Use a network recorder instead that is just like dialling a site, however all video and presentation is recorded. Cisco TCS is one such video recorder device. 2) Use an external mixer to allow the outputs to be split into both monitor inputs and a local recording device.
Using TC Console application found on this site you can mix all audio sources to any Line Out connector.
To play back a local recording via HDMI2 input you can just start presentation and select HDMI2 as presentation source. That works even when device is idle.
Cheers,
David
Hi David,
Thanks for the reply. Made me think about a few more things.
I looked up Cisco TCS. Few questions
a) I believe C40 can conference in 3 additional sites in addition to the main calling site (total 4 sites). So if Cisco TCS dials up C40 for recording, does that mean I have one less additional site available now i.e. 2 instead of 3?
b) I notice that C40 can have video input/output (HDMI/DVI) upto 1080p60, while live encode/decode upto 1080p30 (1472 Kbps). For TCS the live encode/decode is stated as 720p H.264 only (not specified whether 720p30 or 720p60). So, what happens within TCS during recording if the video conference is being broadcast live at 1080p30 (assuming that the 1080p60 HD cameras are being used and 2nd stream content is also 1080p60 at the endpoints)? Is some kind of down-conversion going on to 720p30 or 720p60 ? If this is indeed the case, what is the impact?
c) When TCS dials into C40 for recording, is the C40 local video+audio also recorded along with all remote participants video+audio, and also 2nd stream content (e.g. PC slide or video+audio)?
d) After recording, can TCS playback be done through C40 itself? Does the playback mimic the exact layout on C40 while conference was happening? For example, during actual conference, if HDMI 1 out was showing all remote participants video+audio (e.g. current speaker on fullscreen with overlay, voice switched) and 2nd stream audio, and DVI 2 out was showing 2nd stream content (e.g. PC slide or video only), then TCS playback can replicate this?
Thanks much!
John
Subject: RE: Recording VC session using C40
Replied by: David Bruun-Lie on 09-08-2013 02:14:48 AM
Correct, the network recorder will occupy 1 of the 3 remote site calls leaving 2 availablea) I believe C40 can conference in 3 additional sites in addition to the
main calling site (total 4 sites). So if Cisco TCS dials up C40 for
recording, does that mean I have one less additional site available now
i.e. 2 instead of 3?
Yes, the TCS will signal to the codec its maximum resolution it can receive and the C40 will send the optimal definition to the TCS without affecting the resolution of the other sites. This is called individual transcoding :-) You can set the TCS to record the content in many different file formats and resolutions (simultaneously)b) I notice that C40 can have video input/output (HDMI/DVI) upto
1080p60, while live encode/decode upto 1080p30 (1472 Kbps). For TCS the
live encode/decode is stated as 720p H.264 only (not specified whether
720p30 or 720p60). So, what happens within TCS during recording if the
video conference is being broadcast live at 1080p30 (assuming that the
1080p60 HD cameras are being used and 2nd stream content is also 1080p60
at the endpoints)? Is some kind of down-conversion going on to 720p30
or 720p60 ? If this is indeed the case, what is the impact?
It will record what it receives in the main video stream and presentation stream. As default the C40 wil composite a layout where it sees all sites in the main stream. Audio from all sites + audio from presentation is mixed together and is recorded by TCS.c) When TCS dials into C40 for recording, is the C40 local video+audio
also recorded along with all remote participants video+audio, and also
2nd stream content (e.g. PC slide or video+audio)?
No, the TCS recordings are intended to be viewed from other devices, like PCs, iPads, phones etc. If you want to play it back on the C40 then this will have to be done via a laptop or something similar.... unfortunately.d) After recording, can TCS playback be done through C40 itself? Does
the playback mimic the exact layout on C40 while conference was
happening? For example, during actual conference, if HDMI 1 out was
showing all remote participants video+audio (e.g. current speaker on
fullscreen with overlay, voice switched) and 2nd stream audio, and DVI 2
out was showing 2nd stream content (e.g. PC slide or video only), then
TCS playback can replicate this?
Cheers,
David
Subject: RE: Recording VC session using C40
Replied by: John Mathew on 09-08-2013 05:07:56 AM
David Bruun-Lie[quote=]
Correct, the network recorder will occupy 1 of the 3 remote site calls leaving 2 availablea) I believe C40 can conference in 3 additional sites in addition to the
main calling site (total 4 sites). So if Cisco TCS dials up C40 for
recording, does that mean I have one less additional site available now
i.e. 2 instead of 3?
Can you elaborate on these two conditions, assuming that local C40 does not have multi-site option
a) In case the remote caller (from any H.323 device) dials into local C40 as part of initiating a multi-site call or intitiating 1:1 call, then can TCS dial into remote site which initiated the call for recording?
b) On the other hand, if the local C40 dials into remote H.323 device to join a multi-site call initiated remotely or initiating 1:1 call, can TCS dial into remote site for recording?
c) I assume trying to do it this way causes extra bandwidth needs for connecting local TCS to remote site?
Great this seems nice! But seems at expense of some minor loss of resolution :-)Yes, the TCS will signal to the codec its maximum resolution it can receive and the C40 will send the optimal definition to the TCS without affecting the resolution of the other sites. This is called individual transcoding :-) You can set the TCS to record the content in many different file formats and resolutions (simultaneously)
b) I notice that C40 can have video input/output (HDMI/DVI) upto
1080p60, while live encode/decode upto 1080p30 (1472 Kbps). For TCS the
live encode/decode is stated as 720p H.264 only (not specified whether
720p30 or 720p60). So, what happens within TCS during recording if the
video conference is being broadcast live at 1080p30 (assuming that the
1080p60 HD cameras are being used and 2nd stream content is also 1080p60
at the endpoints)? Is some kind of down-conversion going on to 720p30
or 720p60 ? If this is indeed the case, what is the impact?OK, understand that TCS records two video streams - main and presentation received from C40.It will record what it receives in the main video stream and presentation stream. As default the C40 wil composite a layout where it sees all sites in the main stream. Audio from all sites + audio from presentation is mixed together and is recorded by TCS.c) When TCS dials into C40 for recording, is the C40 local video+audio
also recorded along with all remote participants video+audio, and also
2nd stream content (e.g. PC slide or video+audio)?
a) Are these 2 streams recorded "separately" on two "tracks" simultaneously? If so, the main stream carries the camera stream from 3 remote sites + 1 local camera in the C40 layout? For example the main stream being recorded with current speaker on full screen (any 1 of the 4) with other 3 as overlay at the bottom - is that sort of recording possible to be setup between C40 and TCS?
b)Also is the mixed audio track from from all 4 sites + 1 presentation - is that mixing in stereo sound?
c) I assume TCS converts recording to media file formats? e.g. Flash. If so, during playback, how will these 2 streams appear? Will PC's Flash program screen be split into 2, left showing main video (with all 4 cameras in layout) and right showing presentation, or some similar arrangement?
d) And during TCS recording and transfer to media files, will the TCS's native 720p resolution be preserved within the media files? If not, what maximum resolutions can I expect for main stream and presentation respectively?Please request your product manager to include this in roadmap! I am sure C40 can somehow be made to "read" back the recording? For someone like me who is trying to make a business case in distance learning, recreating the original call in large size/classroom format is probably a big deal :-)No, the TCS recordings are intended to be viewed from other devices, like PCs, iPads, phones etc. If you want to play it back on the C40 then this will have to be done via a laptop or something similar.... unfortunately.d) After recording, can TCS playback be done through C40 itself? Does
the playback mimic the exact layout on C40 while conference was
happening? For example, during actual conference, if HDMI 1 out was
showing all remote participants video+audio (e.g. current speaker on
fullscreen with overlay, voice switched) and 2nd stream audio, and DVI 2
out was showing 2nd stream content (e.g. PC slide or video only), then
TCS playback can replicate this?Cheers,
David
Thanks a lot for your help.
regards
John
Subject: RE: Recording VC session using C40
Replied by: Enrico Conedera on 09-08-2013 09:45:59 AM
John, I think you may be better off engaging a Collaboration Systems Engineer through the Cisco account team or Partner organization, as these pre-sales technical questions are best answered in that fashion.
One correction - the TelePresence Content Server (TCS) does in fact support video playback by dialing in from an endpoint - a C40 in your case. A single TCS can support two simultaneous playback sessions from endpoints. It uses the live streaming ports to do this; so you can use these two ports either for real-time live streaming or video playback from an endpoint. I am unclear on the details, so please contact an expert Systems Engineer with specific knowledge of the Content Server. The Content Server is an excellent product with a long history of development and features. It can be part of a completely automated process for recording and publishing videos, avoiding the need for post-production, transcoding, and manual posting on a web page. We call this solution Capture/Transform/Share.
Again, the Systems Engineering community is expert at demonstrating and explaining these solutions.
regards/enrico
Subject: RE: Recording VC session using C40
Replied by: John Mathew on 09-08-2013 11:31:30 AMSure Enrico, I'll see if I can get to a local Systems Engineer to get the additional questions answered.Enrico Conedera:John, I think you may be better off engaging a Collaboration Systems Engineer through the Cisco account team or Partner organization, as these pre-sales technical questions are best answered in that fashion.Thanks for clarifying this.
One correction - the TelePresence Content Server (TCS) does in fact support video playback by dialing in from an endpoint - a C40 in your case. A single TCS can support two simultaneous playback sessions from endpoints. It uses the live streaming ports to do this; so you can use these two ports either for real-time live streaming or video playback from an endpoint. I am unclear on the details, so please contact an expert Systems Engineer with specific knowledge of the Content Server. The Content Server is an excellent product with a long history of development and features. It can be part of a completely automated process for recording and publishing videos, avoiding the need for post-production, transcoding, and manual posting on a web page. We call this solution Capture/Transform/Share.
Again, the Systems Engineering community is expert at demonstrating and explaining these solutions.
regards/enrico
regards
John
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