Collab Edge / Expressway clustering deployment over 2 sites

[Even .]

Hi all,

I want to ask question about Collab edge deployment in our client.

currently we have one cluster of CUCM, CUC, IM&P separate in two sites (clustering over WAN).

User in site A register to CUCM,CUC IM&P in site A, and User in site B register to CUCM,CUC IM&P in site B.

let's say the domain is example.com

Then i want to deploy collab edge (expressway C & E) on each site.

My question is, is it possible if user in site A register via expressway in site A, and user in site B register via expressway in site B?

Is it possible to use one domain (example.com) ?

or is there any suggestion?

Really appreciate your comment.

Thanks,

Even

[Jonathan Unger]

Hi Even,

To answer your questions:
 

1. The only way to control which user registers with which expressway is through DNS SRV records.

2. Yes it is possible to use one domain.

Please review the Expressway Cluster Creation and Maintenance guide before deploying a cluster:

http://www.cisco.com/c/dam/en/us/td/docs/voice_ip_comm/expressway/config_guide/X8-5/Cisco-Expressway-Cluster-Creation-and-Maintenance-Deployment-Guide-X8-5-2.pdf

[Even .]

Hi Jonathan,

Thank you for your answer.

could you be more specific about how do i need to configure the DNS record?

from what i understand, i need to make DNS SRV Record in Public DNS server, let's say:

_collab-edge._tls.example.com 10 10 8443     -->    expe1.example.com

_collab-edge._tls.example.com 10 10 8443     -->    expe2.example.com

DNS A Record

expe1.example.com  --> ipaddress of Expressway E on site A

expe2.example.com  --> ipaddress of Expressway E on site B

when user in site A & B want to login Jabber, they type the same format "user@example.com" on jabber, how do DNS will know resolve to which ip address of Expressway site A or site B?

Or user in site A and B need to enter different format when they want to login to jabber?

Thanks,

Even

[Jonathan Unger]

Hi Even,

You could configure GeoDNS to return a different Expressway record based on the location of the requesting client (only some DNS providers offer this). There are also other products which can help with type of thing (Citrix NetScaler).

The jabber client is not aware of which expressway it would need to connect through. It will simply connect to the expressway returned by the SRV records, since you have the same priority and weight, clients should be evenly load balanced across the nodes.

Is there a specific use case you are trying to address by having users register through specific expressways?

[Even .]

Hi Jonathan,

Thank you for your response.

I read about GeoDNS and it says that the 2 sites different in location (example: one in US and one in Europe), so GeoDNS  direct the user to the nearest expressway.

Unfortunately, my both 2 sites are within one city, so i think i can't use GeoDNS. Can I?

Yes, the jabber won't know it register to which expressway, but i want to make sure user A to expressway A, and user B to expressway B.

I still don't know if i will deploy the expressway in one cluster or different cluster for the 2 sites because of this issue.

how can i accomplished this ? Do i need to deploy the expressway in one cluster or different cluster?

My customer wants the user in site A register to expressway in site A, and user in site B register to expressway in site B, because if user A register to expressway in site B or vice versa, then it means internet bandwidth in one site can be consumed by user in another site if the DNS direct to the wrong ip address of expressway, (user A consume bandwidth site B if it register to expressway site B and vice versa) and my customer didn't want it to happen.

Thanks,

Even

[moyo oyegunle]

I think you should look into something called Deployments on the Unified Communications Mobile and Remote Access via Cisco Expressway
Deployment Guide 8.5 or later.

Using Deployments MRA clients will be able to log into an expressway pair and the expressway pair will determine which services they connect to( i.e CUCM, IM&P..etc.)

This might not help with the registration expressway bandwidth part but it will definitely help with call bandwidths since clients will use the CUCM they are meant to be connected to. In this case though your expressways would each have to have a connection to all your cucm clusters.

Kindly vote or mark questions as answered if this helps.

[Even .]

Hi Moyo,

Thank you for your answer.

i have read about deployments on MRA, from what i understand, it is used to partition different cluster of CUCM, CUC or IMP, which each cluster has different domain.

Cluster 1 - example.com

Cluster 2 - siteA.example.com

Cluster 3 - siteB.example.com

But in my case, i just have one cluster for CUCM, CUC and IMP (clustering over WAN between 2 sites), and also just using one domain (example.com). Is it possible to use deployments?

Thanks,

Even

[moyo oyegunle]

Didn't notice the single domain requirement.The deployment mode is designed for multiple domains or sub domains. I think the most expedient way to achieve the bandwidth requirement is to use sub domains and deployments that way your users can still sign in using one domain but be directed to the correct nodes.

Possible Option(Don't recommend)

 You can force users to manually enter the service information on the jabber client or script it into their install. This way you can force them to which ever expressway you want. You still have to create DNS records though.

[Even .]

Hi Moyo,

Thanks for your response.

From what I understand about deployments on MRA, it is used to partition UC services when using the same expressway pair.

"The purpose of multiple deployments is to partition the Unified Communications services available to mobile and remote access (MRA) users. This enables different subsets of MRA users to access different sets of services over the same Expressway pair."

So when we have 1 pair of expressway, but we have 3 cluster of cucm or IM&Presence, we can add all of them (3 cluster) to expressway, and partition them using "deployments" based on the domain on each cluster.

example:

cluster 1: example.com

cluster 2: staging.example.com

cluster 3: quiet.example.com

So we can direct users to register to appropriate cluster based on the domain that they entered when log in to jabber.

example:

- Production user entered user1@example.com, and this user will be directed to cluster 1

- Lab user entered user2@staging.example.com, and this user will be directed to cluster 2

- Other user entered user3@quiet.example.com, and this user will be directed to cluster 3

all of DNS SRV record for:

_collab-edge._tls.example.com

_collab-edge._tls.staging.example.com

_collab-edge._tls.quiet.example.com

will return to the same record, and it is A Record of expressway edge server.

am i right about my statement above? i am just assuming from the statement on the guide, because i'm new to this collab edge.

Is it possible to using subdomain if i just have 1 cluster of cucm & im presence?

So from my understanding, deployments is not appropriate solution to my case, because what i need is, my jabber client register to appropriate expressway pair, not register to appropriate UC Services (Because if i'm using one domain (default deployment), i think UC Services is provided by Service Profile assigned to each user on CUCM).

or maybe i got wrong perception about "deployments" here? Please correct me if i'm wrong. any advice will be appreciated.

One question more:

"You can force users to manually enter the service information on the jabber client "

Is this possible? so every time user wants to log in to jabber, they can manually enter expressway edge address? because i don't see any option to manually enter expressway edge address on my jabber client.

Thank you very much Moyo for your kind advise.

Thanks,

Even

[moyo oyegunle]

Hello

So from my understanding of your requirements you want users in Loc A to register and use CUCM/IM&P A and B to do the same for its own B location services.This way client A does not use resources and in B and Client B the same. Since the expressway pair does handle media and signalling it does matter which expressway pair they use to send their registration request. You could deploy 2 expressway pairs as you mentioned but the problem now comes to your CUCM and IM&P.

You are correct about the deployment. In the standard deployment model the user would use the subdomain address to register  on the expressway and each expressway pair would have a connection to each cluster and registration would be routed depending on which CUCM/IM&P is configured in which domain and to which deployment .In your case it is only one cluster so not sure there is a way to divide members of the same cluster into multiple deployments.

There is actually something else you can do you can use the CUCM groups to device your resources.Create 2 new CUCM groups one for location A and another for location B and create specific device pools(assuming this is jabber in full UC mode) to assign to devices in Loc A and Loc B. You can use setup profiles to select which IM&P server is used check cisco jabber deployment guide. This depends on your version ,licensing and deployment model. Probably should have asked that first..lol.

As regards the manual part look into the deployment guide for manual connection.(http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/td/docs/voice_ip_comm/jabber/10_5/CJAB_BK_D6497E98_00_deployment-installation-guide-ciscojabber/requirements.html#JABW_CN_U517728C_00)

Hopefully this helps

[Even .]

Hi Moyo,

Thanks again for your response.

"You could deploy 2 expressway pairs as you mentioned but the problem now comes to your CUCM and IM&P."

I have done the CUCM groups and assign to device pool as you mentioned above, and from what i understand, it doesn't matter which expressway the jabber client register, it will look CUCM configuration and register with appropriate UC services based on the CUCM configuration. so this is not my problem.

I think my main problem is how do i register jabber client user A to expressway on site A, and user B on expressway site B.

let's say in site A i have a set of:

CUCM

CUC

IM&Presence

Expressway-C

Expressway-E

and also in site B, and they are all in one cluster and just have one domain.

for DNS SRV record, i create 1 records and resolve to both ip of expressway:

_collab-edge._tls.example.com 10 10 8443        expresswayA.example.com

                                                                             expresswayB.example.com

Now, user A wants to log in jabber and type "userA@example.com", jabber will auto discovery and either get ip address of expressway A or B (i think it is round robin because both have same priority).

If lucky enough the dns will resolve to ip expressway A, and user A will register to expressway pair A, and if not, user A will register to expressway pair B.

and whether user A register to expressway pair A or B, i think it will always register to correct UC services based on device pool and service profile mentioned above.

so the problem is, when user A log in to jabber and  dns resolve to ip expressway B, jabber user A will register to correct UC Services (Services in site A), but register via expressway B. and vice versa.

so the signaling will be over WAN, not local. and also this cause bandwidth issue where user A will consume bandwidth site B, because when user A make a call to other user/PSTN, it will go through internet bandwidth on site B, via expressway B.

attached drawing for expected and unexpected condition.

For manual configuration of jabber, i think it is only for connection from internal network, we can choose either to register to CUCM (phone only mode) or IM&Presence (Full Mode), there is no option to choose expressway server when we are on outside network.

Thanks,

Even

[moyo oyegunle]

Hello

I somehow assumed your biggest problem was actually how to manage the bandwidth of the jabber clients when they tried to call out.

So the registration problem:

a This should be done by DNS. Different domains for both for your jabber clients A and B but since that is not possible we will move to option b below

b Option B : Manual. I do believe this is quite possible from MRA clients and cisco's flow chart shows it clearly

You will most likely have to do it in the method Cisco used below(vcs-e though but principle should be same)

https://dcloud-cms.cisco.com/help/collaboration-edge-mobile-and-remote-access-endpoint-setup

Note they forced the jabber client to a particular expressway by using username@FQDN of expressway.

Hopefully this helps. 

[Even .]

Hi Moyo,

Thank you for your reply.

Yes, my biggest concern is bandwidth consumption when user make some call. Because i don't have much bandwidth, so i must utilize them effectively .

From the flowchart above, i think it is flowchart for jabber on internal network. are you sure it is also valid when you are outside network? because the flowchart not include service discovery for "_collab-edge". and i also never find document or discussion that says it is possible to use manual setup to login jabber from internet.

And from the link you gave me, i read that user not using "username@FQDN of expressway", but using normal method "username@collabedge-XXX.dc-YY.com", that's not FQDN of expressway, but the domain itself. the FQDN of expressway is actually "vcse.collabedge-XXX.dc-YY.com".

Thanks,

Even

[moyo oyegunle]

Hello

So as regards the chart I do believe so I have attached a screenshot.

As regards the process ,I haven't tried the manual process like they did on that cisco page but my hypothesis is using the user@fqdn would have resolved to user@an expressway ip address eventually so if you did the same but instead forced user A to log in using usrA@public expressway A address and usrB@public expressway B address like in the cisco walkthrough it should work.Either way thanks for asking this question I plan to take out time to test this myself.

[Even .]

Hi Moyo,

Yes, the chart is for jabber MRA, but i still can't find how to manual setup the jabber login process to point to specific expressway. maybe should ask tac... hahaha...

from what i read, i think the domain user entered at jabber login page do affect the entire process, so if you put the FQDN such as "user@expresswayA.example.com", jabber will consider expresswayA.example.com as a domain, which is different from domain of CUCM and IM&Presence, which is example.com. So there is some configuration that we need to do within the user device (voice service domain configuration).

Here is the link:

http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/support/docs/unified-communications/expressway-series/117811-configure-vcs-00.html#anc9

Thanks,

Even