I got this response back from PDI and it appears it is MDS or nothing:
MDS is needed for any BB to have Data connectivity without Data connectivity it won't work as presence or jabber needs data connectivity however, MDS /BES can have its own firewall. So customer may not use ASA at all, and BB can go directly through BES to CUPS for example.
There is no other way, bb has to have data and the only way is through bes and mds