877W, SDM Express and getting it going...

[davidrawle]

Hi,

I am a network engineer and am trying to commission my very first Cisco - an 877W.

I have run into a major problem with SDM Express.

SDM Express starts up and runs fine. I answer all the questions properly and end up at the confirmation page. Everything is checked and I click 'Finish'.

That's it - one dead router.

It says it takes a while to load, so left it for 30 mins and power cycled it. None of the configuration I entered is in there, it's still a factory default.

Tried it on 2 PCs - Win XP Pro SP2, no firewall, no anti-virus. LAN cable (tried a few of those).

Tried it in IE and Firefox on both machines.

Tried a new power supply.

Tried it on Linux and Mac - doesn't like either of those.

Anyone had the same or got a fix? Is it the router or SDM?

I have had a replacement router - both behave the same way.

(My reseller is foxed and Cisco don't offer support :-()

Thanks,

David

[davidrawle]

?

[paolo bevilacqua]

Hi David,

please connect to router with a console cable and terminal program, use exclusively comman line interface. SDM can have bugs, and often doesn;t do what you want.

If you cal tell us what do you want the router to do, we can point to examples.

[davidrawle]

Hi,

Thanks for the fast reply...

All I want to do it the basic setup (LAN, WAN - multiple public IPs, DHCP, Firewall). It doesn't give me a warm fuzzy feeling for Cisco if the tool for initial setup doesn't work.

Later I will want QoS, VPN, DMZ, WLAN, SIP/RTP routing etc.

I was sold this router on the understanding that it had a web interface, I rejected the 1801 cos it didn't :-(

Thanks,

David

[paolo bevilacqua]

Sorry, in short, forget about web interface.

What your isp uses ? PPPoA, PPPoA, bridged ?

[davidrawle]

Thanks for the offer.

I am an ISP and was hoping that an 877W could be my higher-end self install option. So it would need a wizard that actually works.

Customers without IT depts are not going to be comfortable with sticking a cable in their COM port and using the CLI. Using a network engineer would put the 877W way out of its price range. It's very expensive for SMBs anyway.

I guess I'll be sending it back.

I know it's cheeky, but does anyone know of anyone else who make a high quality high availability router that can be given to a customer to install themselves?

(Draytek 2800 is our high end business class router atm, but isn't stable enough for some customers)

Thanks,

David

[patrickvanham]

If you are an ISP I'm wondering why you're not using a provisioning tool to generate (most of) the config on the fly and deliver the router pre-configured to your customers? Customers that are allowed to make changes in the CPE almost always cause problems with their own connection than they solve (there are exceptions, but they use the CLI anyway). Having the router pre-installed and shipped with all the necessary cables, especially when QoS or MPLS is involved, seems a better option.

[davidrawle]

Hi Patrick,

Not sure what CPE is...

We don't work that way - I doubt many others do either.

We don't want to see the routers... they are supplied by our supplier and delivered direct to our customer before provisioning date.

No wires-only/self-install ISP that I know in the UK ships routers preconfigured, the end user is supposed to put in the details themselves.

If they mess it up, a factory reset and re-configure fixes it :-)

[paolo bevilacqua]

No worries. Simply put, cisco products are suitable only if have professionals doing configuration and maintenance.

A consumer-class brand that I can recommend, is Linksys. Some models do support VPN too.

[davidrawle]

Consumer products are not my field... Linksys are quite good for home users though.

Thought a Cisco would be the solution for my higher end customers... obviously not unless you have ridiculous amounts of cash.

[paolo bevilacqua]

At some point, distinction between small office and home users is blur. Linksys is actively addressing the SMB market now.

With cisco, look at the 85x (optional w) then. It does almost all what the 87x does costing a bit less.

On your side all required is providing a configuration template in form of a text file that cover 99% of the needs.

[davidrawle]

Thanks for your advice p,

I have decided that Cisco is not going to be a solution for us until/unless they actually manage to create a router with a comprehensible interface that works. I am guessing that the 85* series uses this same SDM that doesn't work.

I actually wanted a highly reliable solution for our office too. Something that I could recommend to my customers.

If I ever get a customer that is prepared to spend several £1000's on a basic internet connectivity solution I will get a Cisco partner in. I was lead to believe that it could be done for £400. It has so far cost a bit more, without factoring in wasted time, high frustration and stress...

Shame really, but I have been warned off Cisco for the whole of my 23 year time in IT. I should have taken the advice for just a bit longer :-)

[paolo bevilacqua]

Hi David,

I worked for Cisco almost 10 years and I understand the frustration when a new customer comes and the product is not up to expectations. When it happened I always tried to do whatever the possible to change an impasse into a win-win situation. I know that most of my former coworkers have the same approach.

So in all honesty I believe that in almost all applications, nothing beats Cisco.

So, if you want to try and are willing to take the "CLI challenge", I can guarantee you that the 871w will work and do everything what cisco says, and a bit more perhaps.

If it doesn't, I will buy it from you for a price you set (but no more than what you paid, please :)

Price of my consultancy, zero pounds.

What do you think ?

[davidrawle]

:-)

Very kind...

I am just terrified of it now. Reading through these forums, you Cisco guys use so many terms I have never heard before.

The set up for WPA wireless in completely incomprehensible (probably *because* it is so flexible). How do you set up SSID, tick WPA2, enter a shared Key? Should be easy.

How am I ever going to set up port forwarding for SIP and FTP, modify firewall rules etc etc.

What I asked the cisco partner for was:

Best ADSL, WPA Wireless, SIP ALG, FTP ALG router...

1. TOS / QOS for VoIP etc

2. Multiple Public IP addresses going to several machines on a 255.255.255.248 public subnet

3. One of those public IP addresses for general browsing etc for all other machines.

4. FTP server support behind the firewall/NAT (FTP-ALG)

5. Multiple Asterisk server and SIP Phones support behind firewall/NAT (SIP-ALG)

6. uPnP (nice to have, not essential)

7. facility to bar P2P/bittorrent during certain hours only (*very* nice to have)

8. Strong firewall

9. ADSL modem (ADSL 2+ compatible)

10. Wireless G with WPA/WPA2 support

11. Support for 10+ computers both wired and wireless.

As a replacement for a Draytek 2800G which is a dream to set up but no longer stable or powerful enough.

[paolo bevilacqua]

It does all what you said except uPnP.

I need to know from you:

Which encap you use, suppose bridged 1843 ? Which VPI/VCI.

Since I promised, will post an example configuration here. Some points like 4,5 must also be specified exactly, need to know what goes where ?

Note, if need annex-M (high speed upload) you must buy -M models. Regular ones, don't have that.